Kidney Disease Support

Question:

Hi Just wondering if anyone else here might have PKD and how you are dealing with it, symptoms etc… I was diagnosed a few years ago, but nothing has really changed in my life thus far…I don’t want it too but I’m wondering when I can expect things to get more apparent. Thanks for your help!

Response:

Hi Brian,  PKD affects over 600,000 people in the US so we are not alone.  I inherited it from my father, and unfortunately gave it to my son and daughter.  My son’s PKD is more agressive and his creatinine is up to 5.0 which means that he is looking at dialysis within a year or so.  My daughter was just diagnosed. Basically, what you have to do first of all is to keep your blood pressure down, limit your intake of protein, (steaks, eggs, chicken, pork, all meats).  Everyone is different and the progression differs in each case.  You can get a wealth of information on the following sites: Kidney school.org, PKD foundation.org As for me, I am 68 years old and my progression has been very slow so like I said, every one is different.  Also it would be a good idea to see a nephrologist who deals with kidney disease and can get you on a good regimen of diet, and blood testing etc. Hope this has been helpful, Good luck,  A. Torrisi Have a great day!!

Response:

thanks charles! i was diagnosed a few years ago…i go to the nephrologist every six months…but nothing has really changed for me…i guess i’m just waiting for the shoe to drop…i’ve had this now for over 9 years and besides high bp…nothing else has happened yet… i happy how things are…but just wondering what the proression is like…maybe i’m fortunate for a slow advance thx again b – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Charles Torrisi wrote: > Hi Brian,  PKD affects over 600,000 people in the US so we are not > alone.  I inherited it from my father, and unfortunately gave it to my > son and daughter.  My son’s PKD is more agressive and his creatinine is > up to 5.0 which means that he is looking at dialysis within a year or > so.  My daughter was just diagnosed. Basically, what you have to do > first of all is to keep your blood pressure down, limit your intake of > protein, (steaks, eggs, chicken, pork, all meats).  Everyone is > different and the progression differs in each case.  You can get a > wealth of information on the following sites: > Kidney school.org, PKD foundation.org > As for me, I am 68 years old and my progression has been very slow so > like I said, every one is different.  Also it would be a good idea to > see a nephrologist who deals with kidney disease and can get you on a > good regimen of diet, and blood testing etc. > Hope this has been helpful, > Good luck,  A. Torrisi > Have a great day!!

Response:

Question:

Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ?

Depends on manufacturer; I’ve had several batches of metformin from different makers, some (like your current batch) claim that alcohol is contra-indicated, others say it’s okay in moderation. If celebrating, I subscribe to the latter view.

Response:

As it was explained to me, anything that decreases the kidney’s ability to filter the blood can make metformin dangerous.  If you drink heavily that taxes the kidney.  Even more so if you have early diabetic kidney disease. That’s also why you must top taking metformin for three days before they use any kind of injected dye during an x-ray procedure. The dye also overworks the kidney. My doctor said one beer a day would be fine. — Jenny  - Low Carbing for 5 years. Below goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.7 . Cut the carbs to respond to my  email address! Jenny’s new site: What they Don’t Tell You About Diabetes http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/ Jenny’s Low Carb Diet Facts & Figures http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit  http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/Newly%20Diagnosed.htm

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ? Depends on manufacturer; I’ve had several batches of metformin from different makers, some (like your current batch) claim that alcohol is contra-indicated, others say it’s okay in moderation. If celebrating, I subscribe to the latter view.

Response:

Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ? Depends on manufacturer; I’ve had several batches of metformin from different makers, some (like your current batch) claim that alcohol is contra-indicated, others say it’s okay in moderation. If celebrating, I subscribe to the latter view.

 From drugs.com: "Avoid excessive alcohol intake while taking metformin. Together, alcohol and metformin may increase the risk of lactic acidosis and hypoglycemia." rxlist.com and others give similar warnings mostly including the word "excessive".  Bear in mind these are american sites and are not used to the same saturday night town centre phenomenon that we are (or the sunday morning, pavement pizza dodging) Also bear in mind that hypos can be mistaken for drunkenness. Depends on your definition of excessive.  Get bladdered and there’s an outside chance you may wake up in hospital – if you wake up.  Be careful and good luck. VBH T2/UK/A1c 5.8/ 1000Met/Dx Oct-03

Response:

If we beat the Aussies, forget about the Metformin for the weekend and get pissed out of your brain – I’m sure Alan will do the same if the Antipodeans win! — Chris Quinn

I’m quite sober – but then it is 9 am here and some unthinking person told me the result in a different forum just before I was going to watch my videotape On your logic – Karl should be sober too – but I bet he’s not Cheers, Alan, T2 d&e, Australia. Remove weight and carbs to email. — Everything in Moderation – Except Laughter.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ? Was going away for the weekend – Rugby Final Hi Karl A glass or two of wine or beer in moderation is OK. In excess, it is dangerous, not just for metformin. Rugby Final spectators are not renowned for their moderation. I’d stick to the diet coke, but you are going to find that your friends will gradually become very boring. Cheers, Alan, T2 d&e, Australia. Remove weight and carbs to email.

If we beat the Aussies, forget about the Metformin for the weekend and get pissed out of your brain – I’m sure Alan will do the same if the Antipodeans win! — Chris Quinn T2 Metformin 2000mg, Asprin 75mg dx March 04 HBA1c 7.5%, June 04 HBA1c 6.5%, Sep 04

Response:

Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ? Was going away for the weekend – Rugby Final

From experience – yep ! If I do partake in a ‘glass or two’ of the amber coloured nectar, then within 20 minutes I’m rushing to the toilet – not to be sick – but with an attack of the fizzy gravy. May be different for others though ! Cheers Jim

Response:

Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ? Was going away for the weekend – Rugby Final

Hi Karl A glass or two of wine or beer in moderation is OK. In excess, it is dangerous, not just for metformin. Rugby Final spectators are not renowned for their moderation. I’d stick to the diet coke, but you are going to find that your friends will gradually become very boring. Cheers, Alan, T2 d&e, Australia. Remove weight and carbs to email. — Everything in Moderation – Except Laughter.

Response:

Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ? Was going away for the weekend – Rugby Final

I have one glass of wine a night on mine. It knocks my BG way down. The met prevents your liver from adding glucose into your mix if you get too low – which you can do very easily if you overdo the alcohol! Go and enjoy the rugby – but go easy on the booze… Nicky. — HbA1c 10.5/6.4/<6  Weight 95/79/72 1g Metformin, 75ug Thyroxine T2 DX 05/2004

Response:

Have read the instruction and it says No Alcohol – is this hard and fast ? Was going away for the weekend – Rugby Final

Response:

Question:

<snip There is too much money floating around from the Gov’t and the Carbo industry to trust "experts". I knew an attorney once who referred to these types as "medical whores". "They’ll do (say) anything for the right price".

Are you talking about experts here or medical attorneys VBH T2/UK/A1c 5.8/ 1000Met/Dx Oct-03

Response:

Are you talking about experts here or medical attorneys

Both LOL BJ

Response:

Because people with diabetes are often predisposed to kidney disease, the health risks from high-protein dieting intensifies, said Maryellen Eichman- Fiala, a dietitian in the Diabetes Self- Management Education Program at LakeWest Hospital in Willoughby. How old is this idiocy?  "Since people with diabetes are often predisposed to kidney disease, which protein can aggravate, they should avoid protein and consume lots of carbohydrates to ensure they have a reason to avoid protein." She forgot the other part:  "Since people with diabetes are often predisposed to heart disease, which some kinds of fat can aggravate, they should avoid _all_ kinds of fat and consume lots of carbohydrates to ensure they have a reason to avoid fat."

And since people with diabetes cannot control their BG when they consume carbohydrates they ought ot avoid all kinds of carbs. That leave them a diet comprised of mainly of minerals. So much for modern medical nutritional logic. TC

Response:

And since people with diabetes cannot control their BG when they consume carbohydrates they ought ot avoid all kinds of carbs. That leave them a diet comprised of mainly of minerals. So much for modern medical nutritional logic.

No, the official answer to that is you take medicine to keep BG under control. — Wes Groleau Can we afford to be relevant? http://www.cetesol.org/stevick.html

Response:

I am amazed at your brilliance and in depth knowledge of Nutrition, Pharmacology, Anatomy and especially Physiology of the Kidney. You massive understanding of the Diabetic….all types…..all complications. I will never be the same after reading the posting your purloined from another source. Kilty

Response:

Because people with diabetes are often predisposed to kidney disease, the health risks from high-protein dieting intensifies, said Maryellen Eichman- Fiala, a dietitian in the Diabetes Self- Management Education Program at LakeWest Hospital in Willoughby. How old is this idiocy?  "Since people with diabetes are often predisposed to kidney disease, which protein can aggravate, they should avoid protein and consume lots of carbohydrates to ensure they have a reason to avoid protein." She forgot the other part:  "Since people with diabetes are often predisposed to heart disease, which some kinds of fat can aggravate, they should avoid _all_ kinds of fat and consume lots of carbohydrates to ensure they have a reason to avoid fat."

Thankfully she also missed that other obvious one. People with diabetes always die when their lives end. Beav

Response:

And since people with diabetes cannot control their BG when they consume carbohydrates they ought ot avoid all kinds of carbs. That leave them a diet comprised of mainly of minerals. So much for modern medical nutritional logic. No, the official answer to that is you take medicine to keep BG under control.

Now ain’t THAT the fucking truth!!! I just got out of hospital (nothing related to DM btw) and was told as I was leavng "Now don’t stop taking the pain killers and don’t stop taking them in an instant. Reduce them over time". So… this time next month I could be addicted to some drug or other, or I could be like I am now and not, because I stopped taking them the very instant she said that. Beav

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What an idiot.  Anyone should know that Atkins is not high protein, but high fat. Any REAL idiot knows that Atkins, as well as any other sensible low-carb regimen, is about choosing foods that are low in carbohydrates as well as dense in nutrients.  Such foods abound, and are available from any grocery, but who wants to eat spinach when frozen pizza is on the next aisle? There’s no magic bullet associated with low-carbing.  What we do is eat a lot of fresh veggies and meats, and drink lots of water. THIS is supposed to be DANGEROUS?

And of course, rocket science, which is why so many arseholes are jumping on the "Anti low(er) carb" bandwagon. Beav

Response:

Dieticians know crap and have been responsible for more complications from the progression of diabetes than anyone can imagine. Quite simply, the dietiticians tell a patient to eat more carbs than their pancreas can handle but because most folk like to believe a professional has their best interests at heart, they follow blindly. Result is often deterioration of their condition due to poor control with the resulting serious complications.

Jan, I do believe I love you:-)) When I met my first "crapatician", she told me that I should consume a minimum of 210grams per day, but preferably closer to 300. I think she may have been the first woman I looked directly in the eye and said "Kiss my arse" (or something similar:-)) Beav

Response:

<snip the psycho babble Hey, can we refer to you from now on as "Master Bayt?" — Peter 270/215/180 Before/Current Pix: http://users.thelink.net/marengo/weightlosspix/weightlosspix.html

Response:

Thankfully she also missed that other obvious one. People with diabetes always die when their lives end.

Or the other obvoius. When you eat lots of carbohydrates your bg’s are hard to control and the resulting higher bg’s cause…. kidney problems!! Lol. Twit.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dieticians know crap and have been responsible for more complications from the progression of diabetes than anyone can imagine. Quite simply, the dietiticians tell a patient to eat more carbs than their pancreas can handle but because most folk like to believe a professional has their best interests at heart, they follow blindly. Result is often deterioration of their condition due to poor control with the resulting serious complications. Jan, I do believe I love you:-))

I think Beavette might have something to say there. When I met my first "crapatician", she told me that I should consume a minimum of 210grams per day, but preferably closer to 300. I think she may have been the first woman I looked directly in the eye and said "Kiss my arse" (or something similar:-))

First woman? Hmm didn’t pick you for being the unadventurous type Maybe you meant the first woman you *told* not *asked*. :p

Response:

<snip the psycho babble Hey, can we refer to you from now on as "Master Bayt?"

I think that would be most appropriate. And he obviously has 2 appendages as you couldn’t be that stupid with just one.

Response:

Thankfully she also missed that other obvious one. People with diabetes always die when their lives end. Or the other obvoius. When you eat lots of carbohydrates your bg’s are hard to control and the resulting higher bg’s cause…. kidney problems!! Lol. Twit.

The word is full of ‘em Beav

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dieticians know crap and have been responsible for more complications from the progression of diabetes than anyone can imagine. Quite simply, the dietiticians tell a patient to eat more carbs than their pancreas can handle but because most folk like to believe a professional has their best interests at heart, they follow blindly. Result is often deterioration of their condition due to poor control with the resulting serious complications. Jan, I do believe I love you:-)) I think Beavette might have something to say there. When I met my first "crapatician", she told me that I should consume a minimum of 210grams per day, but preferably closer to 300. I think she may have been the first woman I looked directly in the eye and said "Kiss my arse" (or something similar:-)) First woman? Hmm didn’t pick you for being the unadventurous type

Yeah, well I’ve never met a blokey type crapatician:-)  Maybe you meant the first woman you *told* not *asked*. :p

Mmm, I believe you have a point )) Beav

Response:

she may have been the first woman I looked directly in the eye and said "Kiss my arse" (or something similar:-)) First woman? Hmm didn’t pick you for being the unadventurous type Maybe you meant the first woman you *told* not *asked*. :p Actually, being Beav, I read that as he’d done it before, just not looking her direct in the eyes at the time ….

I’ve shouted it through car windows ))) Beav

Response:

Actually, being Beav, I read that as he’d done it before, just not looking her direct in the eyes at the time …. I’ve shouted it through car windows ))) Open ????

Don’t be daft, d’you think I’m mad? Beav

Response:

Open ???? Don’t be daft, d’you think I’m mad? Beav, do I *have* to answer that question ?? )

Call me retard. go on, call me RETARD!!!!! )) Beav

Response:

I won’t bother to reprint the crap that the Plain Dealer published, but I will say that I am on the Atkins diet (for over two years now) so I guess I would say the Atkins Way of Eating. I am doing this with my doctor’s blessing and regular checkups. I’ve lost 70 lbs, my Type 2 diabetes no longer requires medications. My resting heart rate varies in the low 60s, my formerly high blood pressure is about 117/70. I have no night sweats. So basically I have the same BP and heart rate I had as a high school baseballer and I’m 57. There is too much money floating around from the Gov’t and the Carbo industry to trust "experts". I knew an attorney once who referred to these types as "medical whores". "They’ll do (say) anything for the right price".

Response:

What an idiot.  Anyone should know that Atkins is not high protein, but

high fat. Any REAL idiot knows that Atkins, as well as any other sensible low-carb regimen, is about choosing foods that are low in carbohydrates as well as dense in nutrients.  Such foods abound, and are available from any grocery, but who wants to eat spinach when frozen pizza is on the next aisle? There’s no magic bullet associated with low-carbing.  What we do is eat a lot of fresh veggies and meats, and drink lots of water. THIS is supposed to be DANGEROUS?

Response:

<drivel snipped Below the **** is the article. Nutritionists warn diabetics to be wary of Atkins diet Tuesday, July 20, 2004 Kylene Kiang Plain Dealer Reporter For people who have diabetes, high- protein and

low-carbohydrate diets such as the Atkins diet should be used with caution, health experts advise.

I low carb without high protein, next… The risks are twofold. Not only does protein overload stress the kidneys,

Wrong  but also the severe decrease in carbohydrate intake can lead to dangerously low blood-sugar levels, which may induce

diabetic coma Wrong again, biggest load of bullshit I have ever read. Type 2 diabetics do not go low because of low carb intake. If they were taking insulin it is a possibility but most insulin users are aware of how much insulin per carb intake to shoot. So got any other brilliant announcements that accompany your ignorance and obvious lack of diabetic experience? Low-carb diets are based on the idea that if carbohydrate intake is limited, the body will use its own fat as a main source of energy. When the body feeds on its fat stores, byproducts known as ketone bodies form and induce a state called ketosis.

So? Ketones can appear in people using any weight loss program. Ketosis is the same state typical for people who are fasting or experiencing extreme starvation.

And because people using a non Atkins style diet to lose weight can also produce ketones that statement means what? You don’t have to starve or be extreme to produce ketones. Do you believe everything you read? For some people on low-carb diets, in addition to the rapid loss of fat, muscle tissue decreases, and for some, heart tissue can be lost, Eichman-Fiala said.

Prove it. And not with cites you googled, proper medical cites from say Medscape etc. The Atkins diet does not allow fruit, bread, pasta, grains, nuts, milk and starchy vegetables to be eaten during the first two weeks of the program, which can reduce carbohydrates to as low as 10 percent of what dieticians recommend. After this induction phase, more foods with carbohydrates are slowly reintroduced into the diet.

Dieticians know crap and have been responsible for more complications from the progression of diabetes than anyone can imagine. Quite simply, the dietiticians tell a patient to eat more carbs than their pancreas can handle but because most folk like to believe a professional has their best interests at heart, they follow blindly. Result is often deterioration of their condition due to poor control with the resulting serious complications. Nancy Dame, a registered dietician at Cuyahoga Falls General Hospital, said her main concern with mixing low-carb diets and diabetes is the likelihood of dangerously low blood-sugar levels during the first two weeks of the diet. Because many food groups are missing from the induction phase, Atkins guidelines recommend taking vitamin supplements. But Dame said taking pills is never the same as eating

actual food. For two measly weeks, big deal.  People who drink a lot of alcohol and smoke every day will have a far greater loss of essential vitamins and minerals than someone doing a 2 week diet.  I don’t see the Danger, Will Robinson thing plastered all over the newspapers over that group of people. "You might be getting vitamin A and vitamin C, but it’s not going to replace things like fiber and other phytonutrients."

Metamucil for 2 weeks, big deal. But when choosing a diet, people should keep in mind that long-term health benefits are uncertain for many low-carb plans, she said. "Whether it’s the ice cream diet or the alcoholic’s diet . . . all of those diets can work in the short run," she said.

Same old same old, that argument gets old very quickly. Those who low carb know other long term low carbers. It is a very doable way of life. To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

No thanks.

Response:

Nutritionists warn diabetics to be wary of Atkins diet Tuesday, July 20, 2004 Kylene Kiang Plain Dealer Reporter For people who have diabetes, high- protein and low-carbohydrate diets such as the Atkins diet should be used with caution, health experts advise.

What an idiot.  Anyone should know that Atkins is not high protein, but high fat. To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

Question:

STEVE BAYT (Parma, Brook Park,Ohio) Below is an article that appeared in the July 20,2004 Plain Dealer life section that reports on what I was going to in a few weeks. That is the low carb lethalness(lethality) (if those are actual words), of Atkins and diabetes. Technically I am not claiming authorship and am not making money off my efforts against Atkins and Senate Bill 722 and H.R. 3377. So, technically this posting isn’t subject to civil litiagation. And Kylene Kiang saved me two weeks work. So, I get an extra posting for name recognition for the day I might someday be on Paula Zahn Now, Anderson Cooper 360 or have my own activist column in thousands newspapers throughout the country where I donate 95% of my revenues to charities. So, I thank THE Plain Dealer for helping to save lives and I hope people take this article to their doctors, whose are the only reponses I care about, not one-line brain dead posters probably too brainwashed by Atkins to realize their inevitable fate. Below the **** is the article. Nutritionists warn diabetics to be wary of Atkins diet Tuesday, July 20, 2004 Kylene Kiang Plain Dealer Reporter For people who have diabetes, high- protein and low-carbohydrate diets such as the Atkins diet should be used with caution, health experts advise. The risks are twofold. Not only does protein overload stress the kidneys, but also the severe decrease in carbohydrate intake can lead to dangerously low blood-sugar levels, which may induce diabetic coma Research shows high-protein diets often contribute to an enlargement of the kidneys, said Marcia Silver, assistant professor of medicine at the Case Western Reserve University School of Medicine. "The unusually large size of the kidney is an indication that the kidney is working harder than it normally should," Silver said. "Kidneys that are pushed to function more early in life are prone to failure." Because people with diabetes are often predisposed to kidney disease, the health risks from high-protein dieting intensifies, said Maryellen Eichman- Fiala, a dietitian in the Diabetes Self- Management Education Program at LakeWest Hospital in Willoughby. According to the Atkins Nutritional Web site, kidney dysfunction will occur during the diet only if "someone is already suffering from far-advanced kidney disease." The site maintains that protein has nothing to do with the cause of the kidney problem. Low-carb diets are based on the idea that if carbohydrate intake is limited, the body will use its own fat as a main source of energy. When the body feeds on its fat stores, byproducts known as ketone bodies form and induce a state called ketosis. Ketosis is the same state typical for people who are fasting or experiencing extreme starvation. For some people on low-carb diets, in addition to the rapid loss of fat, muscle tissue decreases, and for some, heart tissue can be lost, Eichman-Fiala said. "The last I looked, no one needs to lose that," she said. The Atkins diet does not allow fruit, bread, pasta, grains, nuts, milk and starchy vegetables to be eaten during the first two weeks of the program, which can reduce carbohydrates to as low as 10 percent of what dietitians recommend. After this induction phase, more foods with carbohydrates are slowly reintroduced into the diet. Nancy Dame, a registered dietitian at Cuyahoga Falls General Hospital, said her main concern with mixing low-carb diets and diabetes is the likelihood of dangerously low blood-sugar levels during the first two weeks of the diet. People with diabetes who allow their blood sugars to drop to severely low levels may pass out, develop tremors or go into a diabetic coma, Dame said. Because many food groups are missing from the induction phase, Atkins guidelines recommend taking vitamin supplements. But Dame said taking pills is never the same as eating actual food. "You might be getting vitamin A and vitamin C, but it’s not going to replace things like fiber and other phytonutrients." For people managing diabetes, Eichman-Fiala suggests limiting carbohydrates rather than eliminating them. Although she does not recommend the Atkins diet for people with diabetes, she said a positive effect of the low-carb craze is the greater recognition that overloading on carbohydrates is unhealthy. But when choosing a diet, people should keep in mind that long-term health benefits are uncertain for many low-carb plans, she said. "Whether it’s the ice cream diet or the alcoholic’s diet . . . all of those diets can work in the short run," she said. To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

Question:

Helen, I’ll add my experiences to yours as far as cats with less than 4 legs.  My Lady Bug, who went to a new home a few months back because of my allergies to her long fur, had only three legs.  When she was given to me by my vet, she had been in a accident.  She was hit by a car and taken to my vet by a good Samaritan.  She almost lost her life, but made it thanks to a very good and loving vet.  She did lose her front left shoulder and leg though.  she was approximately two at the time.  The people who ‘owned’ her didn’t want her because she was ‘injured’ and told vets to just put her to sleep.  What a waste of a beautiful cat and her three legs up until the time of the accident, but came out of the surgery for from being groggy without missing a beat.  You’d never have known she was missing a leg.  She played, ran around the house, ripped over furniture while playing and jumped just like any other cat.  In fact, when playing with her favorite toy (the piece of denim attached to a flexible wand by a special kind of thread ) she would jump higher than any cat I’ve ever seen jump.  And that’s no joke.  I’ve had several people mention it when watching her play with that toy.  So here is — Purrs & Hugs, BlueBird & Little Bit To E-Mail direct remove the hutch – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated *OOOOOOOODLES* of purrs. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone If it helps, I know of a kitten who lost a front leg, and has grown up to be a mad, funny, crazy cat – in other words – quite normal Cheers, helen s –This is an invalid email address to avoid spam– to get correct one remove dependency on fame & fortune

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone — Shirley see my cats at http://communities.msn.co.uk/Friendsfamilyandfelines2 http://uk.msnusers.com/friendsfamilyandfelines3

purrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrs! Brenda

Response:

Big purrs, for a brave little cat, and hugs too from Wilson and me    Jean P.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone — Shirley see my cats at http://communities.msn.co.uk/Friendsfamilyandfelines2 http://uk.msnusers.com/friendsfamilyandfelines3

Response:

Lots of purrs and best wishes for La Nina’s wound to have healed properly and hugs for you for taking such good care of her, — Polonca & Soncek

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone — Shirley see my cats at http://communities.msn.co.uk/Friendsfamilyandfelines2 http://uk.msnusers.com/friendsfamilyandfelines3

Response:

Ahhhh, Steve.  I see you have a Little Bit, also.  I hope that he/she gives you as much pleasure and love as my Little Bit does me.  Because of the kidney disease she was born with she was so small at the age of 9-10 weeks old that she fit in my cupped hands and I have very small hands !!!!

Yep, my Little Bit is a joy, and is my cuddle kitty. She was about 8 pounds when she showed up and announced that she was moving in, and very pregnant – had her kittens in the bedroom closet a week or so after moving in closet. She’s not so little nowadays at around 10 pounds, borderline on what TED tells me her max weight should be before being put on a diet. — Steve Touchstone, faithful servant of Sammy, Little Bit and Rocky Home Page: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/index.html Cat Pix: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/animals.html

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone Several years ago our local Wildbird store had a cat with only two legs. It was amzing how she adapted. She loved all the attention she got from customers. Purrs for La Nina to heal quickly. CATherine

You’re right, it’s amazing how well they do. My great aunt had a kitten that lost a leg. You’d never have known when it was young, though. It was always running and playing so hard that you couldn’t count the legs. In its teens it developed arthritis in its one front leg, so it short of hitched its way along, but it was always there to great visitors and get its expected attention. I’ve been trying all evening to remember it’s name, but it won’t come to me. It didn’t come along until after I joined the Army, so I only saw it a few times over the years, while home on leave. If I have my facts straight, it lived to be about twenty, and went to the RB three or four years ago. — Steve Touchstone, faithful servant of Sammy, Little Bit and Rocky Home Page: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/index.html Cat Pix: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/animals.html

Response:

La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated

*OOOOOOOODLES* of purrs. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone

If it helps, I know of a kitten who lost a front leg, and has grown up to be a mad, funny, crazy cat – in other words – quite normal Cheers, helen s –This is an invalid email address to avoid spam– to get correct one remove dependency on fame & fortune

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La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone

Healing purrs on the way. — Adrian A house is not a home, without a cat.

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I suppose by now the stitches are out, but Little Bit and I are sending purrs anyway.  BTW, since I don’t know the story, what happened that this sweet kitten had to have this done ?  That is if it’s not too hard a subject to talk about.  Prayers and purrs that sweet, LaNina, the talkative kitten will be just fine !!!!! — BlueBird To e-mail direct, remove the hutch.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone — Shirley see my cats at http://communities.msn.co.uk/Friendsfamilyandfelines2 http://uk.msnusers.com/friendsfamilyandfelines3

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I suppose by now the stitches are out, but Little Bit and I are sending purrs anyway.  BTW, since I don’t know the story, what happened that this sweet kitten had to have this done ?  That is if it’s not too hard a subject to talk about.  Prayers and purrs that sweet, LaNina, the talkative kitten will be just fine !!!!!

This is the first I have read about LaNina and TuTu and I shall purr for her wellbeing and swift recovery.  I did some research but cannot find a former story.  I, too, wonder what happened?  MLB

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La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone

Several years ago our local Wildbird store had a cat with only two legs. It was amzing how she adapted. She loved all the attention she got from customers. Purrs for La Nina to heal quickly. CATherine

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La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone

Aww, she sounds like a wonderful character. Many purrs for the stitch-removal. — Marina, Frank and Nikki Email marina (dot) kurten (at) pp (dot) inet (dot) fi Pics at http://uk.f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/frankiennikki

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  oh, how sweet. She must be a darling kitty. We will purr and pray that everything goes well. They are very resilient and I’m sure she will manage very well. God bless her.   Jazz & his mama   —   Irulan   from the stars we came, to the stars we return   from now until the end of time   La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few   purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated.     She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed   her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands   on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to   have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with   everyone     —   Shirley   see my cats at   http://communities.msn.co.uk/Friendsfamilyandfelines2   http://uk.msnusers.com/friendsfamilyandfelines3    

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Many best healing purrs for the little babycat! Christine

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone — Shirley see my cats at http://communities.msn.co.uk/Friendsfamilyandfelines2 http://uk.msnusers.com/friendsfamilyandfelines3

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La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone

Purrs and good luck thoughts and wishes for La Nina, and thanks to you for taking care of her. Pam, Rob, and the NC nine

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La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated.

… Shirley Purrs for La Nina.  She sounds like such a character. Annie

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Ahhhh, Steve.  I see you have a Little Bit, also.  I hope that he/she gives you as much pleasure and love as my Little Bit does me.  Because of the kidney disease she was born with she was so small at the age of 9-10 weeks old that she fit in my cupped hands and I have very small hands !!!! — Purrs & Hugs, BlueBird & Little Bit To E-Mail direct remove the hutch

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone Several years ago our local Wildbird store had a cat with only two legs. It was amzing how she adapted. She loved all the attention she got from customers. Purrs for La Nina to heal quickly. CATherine You’re right, it’s amazing how well they do. My great aunt had a kitten that lost a leg. You’d never have known when it was young, though. It was always running and playing so hard that you couldn’t count the legs. In its teens it developed arthritis in its one front leg, so it short of hitched its way along, but it was always there to great visitors and get its expected attention. I’ve been trying all evening to remember it’s name, but it won’t come to me. It didn’t come along until after I joined the Army, so I only saw it a few times over the years, while home on leave. If I have my facts straight, it lived to be about twenty, and went to the RB three or four years ago. — Steve Touchstone, faithful servant of Sammy, Little Bit and Rocky Home Page: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/index.html Cat Pix: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/animals.html

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La Nina is going to have her stitches out in the morning so a few purrs that the wound has healed properly would be much appreciated. She’s a lively little thing and losing one of her legs hasn’t slowed her down (except when she forgets she’s missing a front leg and lands on her nose). I’ve never known such a talkative kitten, she seems to have an opinion on everything and doesn’t mind sharing it with everyone — Shirley see my cats at http://communities.msn.co.uk/Friendsfamilyandfelines2 http://uk.msnusers.com/friendsfamilyandfelines3

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Purrs for the little fighter! — Victor Martinez Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)

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Question:

I am not being extreme.  Read the book "Food Pets Die For".  It tells the story how a woman’s dog died from Purina Dog Chow having 10,000 times more zinc in it that it should have.  Iams is notorious and gaining reputation for initiating kidney disease.  Just because she’s a dog or cat doesn’t mean that she should be feed crap or inferior ingredients.  Expired eggs, including the carton are acceptable ingredients listed as protein and fiber from pet food manufacturers Road kill, our pets that have been put to sleep for whatever reason (cancer, leukemia, lupus…)  Stuff expired from the grocery store…. = pet food.  Is that good enough for a healthy long life?? NO!  Would you be ok eating that?  NO!

I’ve been perusing Google and the web concerning Mrs. Martin.  I’m not impressed.  She’s made some pretty fantastic claims, but when pressed for proof she gets coy far too often.  I’d take what she says with more than a grain of salt – I’d lean towards a *salt lick*.  The tactic of making outrageous claims in support of what might well be a worthy mission is an excellent way to deprive the subject of its credibility. Carmen

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I’m very impressed, Carmen, that you researched this!! Martin’s book just an example of pet food issues.  There are plenty more books that go into details of what does goes into pet food. In your spare time, Google ethoxyquin. Purrz…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am not being extreme.  Read the book "Food Pets Die For".  It tells the story how a woman’s dog died from Purina Dog Chow having 10,000 times more zinc in it that it should have.  Iams is notorious and gaining reputation for initiating kidney disease.  Just because she’s a dog or cat doesn’t mean that she should be feed crap or inferior ingredients.  Expired eggs, including the carton are acceptable ingredients listed as protein and fiber from pet food manufacturers Road kill, our pets that have been put to sleep for whatever reason (cancer, leukemia, lupus…)  Stuff expired from the grocery store…. = pet food.  Is that good enough for a healthy long life?? NO!  Would you be ok eating that?  NO! I’ve been perusing Google and the web concerning Mrs. Martin.  I’m not impressed.  She’s made some pretty fantastic claims, but when pressed for proof she gets coy far too often.  I’d take what she says with more than a grain of salt – I’d lean towards a *salt lick*.  The tactic of making outrageous claims in support of what might well be a worthy mission is an excellent way to deprive the subject of its credibility. Carmen

– Judy 197.5/191.5/160 5′ 11"

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FYI, Iams has been reformulated & is now a grocery store food equivalent to Purina. And since this list is supposed to be about human low carb diets, I will not belabor the point other than to suggest that the pet owners on the list do as much research into what their animals are eating as what they do into their own foods. Reading the ingredients can be enlightening:)Robyn

Very true! And the worse part is that the animals simply do not know any better. It may be cute to give fido tons of human food, but when they are older and develop hip problems etc…it can be so miserable. Myway

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FYI, Iams has been reformulated & is now a grocery store food equivalent to Purina. And since this list is supposed to be about human low carb diets, I will not belabor the point other than to suggest that the pet owners on the list do as much research into what their animals are eating as what they do into their own foods. Reading the ingredients can be enlightening:)Robyn

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Iams is HORRIBLE food!!!   I think this is a bit extreme.  ;) I have a close friend who is a biochemist, and she fed her much-beloved golden-retriever/lab mix nothing but Iams for the dog’s entire life.  That wonderful dog just died naturally last year of old age at 20 years old

You don’t just die of "old age".  Something goes wrong which causes death. I am not being extreme.  Read the book "Food Pets Die For".  It tells the story how a woman’s dog died from Purina Dog Chow having 10,000 times more zinc in it that it should have.  Iams is notorious and gaining reputation for initiating kidney disease.  Just because she’s a dog or cat doesn’t mean that she should be feed crap or inferior ingredients.  Expired eggs, including the carton are acceptable ingredients listed as protein and fiber from pet food manufacturers Road kill, our pets that have been put to sleep for whatever reason (cancer, leukemia, lupus…)  Stuff expired from the grocery store…. = pet food.  Is that good enough for a healthy long life??  NO!  Would you be ok eating that?  NO! Iams is not good food.  I will say that it is better than stuff you get at the grocer.  You have to read the ingredient label!  You will avoid expensive vet bills later, by feeding good now! BTW, I just found out tonight that my close friend’s sister, son has mercury poisoning from a mandatory vaccine.  If we are this lackadaisical with human kids, I can only imagine what goes on with our pets….but I guess that’s an entirely new topic…vaccines — Judy 197.5/192/160   5′ 11"

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my beagle can eat ten times faster than I can.  if I tried this, I would starve.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories. I hope this helps! Cubit 308/295.5/165

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – website:  http://users.thelink.net/marengo I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories. I hope this helps! Cubit 308/295.5/165 LMAO! I Gotta try this with my cat Yoda!  Only problem is, I’d have to eat the bacon raw in order for him to eat it too!  <g p.s.  So how fat is Arthur now…? — Peter

I’m glad someone realized that I had humor in mind as I presented my true story. The vet says Arthur is overweight, but it is just a couple of pounds.  He weighs about 20 pounds.  As a Pomeranian he is covered with a mass of fluff. This hides his true body size.  Arthur is twice as big as either of his parents.

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Did you see that John Stossel Exposee on 20/20? about agricultural incentives? Im even MORE psyched to stay on Low Carb NOW after THAT! Do you have an url of the transcript?  (I don’t watch much tv anymore)

I looked and couldnt find anything about it, it was about how the government gives certyain growers incentives to produce alot of their crop, and GUESS WHAT THAT CROP usually is? Corn! thats why Coke has corn syrup in it and not cane sugar! Thats why there are so many corn products on the mkt! And we need NONE of it! Did anyone else see this? They also showed a scummy advertiser that his whole job was mkting crap to kids! preesi

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Well, lets be fair Im not feeding my GSP Kibbles and Bits, Its good food, IAMS!

Iams is HORRIBLE food!!!  They use a rubber derivitive, ethoxyquin. Will more than likely cause kidney disease when the pet is older, amognst other health issues!!!  Worse than Iams or Science Diet is anything that is available in a grocery store. Read the label of your pet food!  Cats are carnivores and kinda follow our LC way of living!  A vegetable or by-product should not be listed in the first few ingredients of dog or cat food!! Bacon nor any pork product, should not be fed to a cat or dog.  Your’e looking for heart problems if you do this on a regular basis. — Judy 197.5/192/160   5′ 11"

Response:

website:  http://users.thelink.net/marengo

I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories. I hope this helps! Cubit 308/295.5/165

LMAO! I Gotta try this with my cat Yoda!  Only problem is, I’d have to eat the bacon raw in order for him to eat it too!  <g p.s.  So how fat is Arthur now…? — Peter

Response:

Well, lets be fair Im not feeding my GSP Kibbles and Bits, Its good food, IAMS! Iams is HORRIBLE food!!!  They use a rubber derivitive, ethoxyquin. Will more than likely cause kidney disease when the pet is older, amognst other health issues!!!  Worse than Iams or Science Diet is anything that is available in a grocery store.

I think this is a bit extreme.  ;) I have a close friend who is a biochemist, and she fed her much-beloved golden-retriever/lab mix nothing but Iams for the dog’s entire life.  That wonderful dog just died naturally last year of old age at 20 years old — 140  in human years!  She is a walking advertisement for IAMS.  It can’t be all that bad! Just another opinion of course  :) — Peter website:  http://users.thelink.net/marengo

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Cheap, processed grains that are the waste products that are not nutritious enough to go into Captain Crunch are not a good thing to feed Robyn Lori Rosenthal Sterling Cotons and Park Place Grooming Sterling, VA USA

Are you trying to tell me there exists ANY waste product not good enough for Cap’n Crunch? (shudders) — Email: Remove "SPARKS"

Response:

Did you see that John Stossel Exposee on 20/20? about agricultural incentives? Im even MORE psyched to stay on Low Carb NOW after THAT!

Do you have an url of the transcript?  (I don’t watch much tv anymore) — revek A conclusion is simply the place where you got tired of thinking.

Response:

Their usual answer to any nutritional question is to feed nothing but dry bagged food because it is too "complicated and difficult" for the average human to feed a dog properly. Doesn’t that sound a little suspicious to you?

Yes, especially since dogs will eat vermin on the side of the road if they are in the wild! And if a diet based on refined carbs is not good for humans, why would it be good for dogs? Dogs have straight digestive tracts, closer to humans than to sheep or cows, and pointy teeth for tearing, not flat for grinding.

Well, lets be fair Im not feeding my GSP Kibbles and Bits, Its good food, IAMS! I know you are saying RIGHT NOW that that aint much better but Hes healthy! http://mywebpages.comcast.net/preesi/SleepyDog.jpg Cheap, processed grains that are the waste products that are not nutritious enough to go into Captain Crunch are not a good thing to

Did you see that John Stossel Exposee on 20/20? about agricultural incentives? Im even MORE psyched to stay on Low Carb NOW after THAT! preesi

Response:

CARBS are NOT good for doggies! Too much carb leads to diarrhea!

The Vet told me that about Fat,, cause I was giving my GSP pigs ears and he was poopin all over and the vet told me no fatty treats! preesi

Response:

CARBS are NOT good for doggies! Too much carb leads to diarrhea! The Vet told me that about Fat,, cause I was giving my GSP pigs ears and he was poopin all over and the vet told me no fatty treats! preesi

Oh that’s right, the FAT IS BAD paradigm is still alive in some places. Pig ears are not bad becuase they are fat, pig ears are bad becuase they are nasty, dirty, rancid fat. Just FYI, most vet schools require one 3 credit nutrition course which covers the entire topic of "animal nutrition," cats, dogs, sheep cattle, etc. Their usual answer to any nutritional question is to feed nothing but dry bagged food because it is too "complicated and difficult" for the average human to feed a dog properly. Doesn’t that sound a little suspicious to you? And if a diet based on refined carbs is not good for humans, why would it be good for dogs? Dogs have straight digestive tracts, closer to humans than to sheep or cows, and pointy teeth for tearing, not flat for grinding. Cheap, processed grains that are the waste products that are not nutritious enough to go into Captain Crunch are not a good thing to feed any living being. Robyn Lori Rosenthal Sterling Cotons and Park Place Grooming Sterling, VA USA

Response:

I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories.  NOOOO, then you’ll both have to diet! FAT is NOT good for doggies!

I’m sorry that isn’t true. They want it (Pigs ears are all fat) but they shouldnt get it. Too much fat leads to diarrhea!

Your vet is uninformed, but that isn’t unusual. http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=barf My own anectdote.  Both my cats and my dog started out on dry pet food. They all became over time sickly and run down.  The dog’s nose was always dry, the cats’ noses were near white.  They all slept a lot, and had BO– this is normal in cats, but the dog is a Jack Russel and that is highly unusual behavior.  At first I thought it was low quality kibble.  So I tried getting expensive formulations.  No dice.    I eventually had my eyes opened when I ran across the concept of BARF.  I put them on a meat diet– some canned, some raw, the occasional raw bone, and a vitamin to cover my bases.  Within a few days the reversal was noticable.  Cat noses were bright pink again, the dog’s was wet and cold.  All had loads of energy and sparkly eyes, shiny coats and the BO had reduced considerably.  They started acting like ‘kids’ again instead of old arthritic geezers and actually played with each other for hours every day instead of sleeping.  Conclusion: no kibble in my house ever again. Now salt on the other hand they don’t need so much of and bacon has loads. — revek "It was only after their population of fifty mysteriously shrank to eight, that the other seven dwarfs began to suspect Hungry."

Response:

I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories.

My kitties are all jumping up and down saying, "Try it!  We’ll help!" Priscilla

Response:

I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories.

 NOOOO, then you’ll both have to diet! FAT is NOT good for doggies! They want it (Pigs ears are all fat) but they shouldnt get it. Too much fat leads to diarrhea! preesi

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories. NOOOO, then you’ll both have to diet! FAT is NOT good for doggies! They want it (Pigs ears are all fat) but they shouldnt get it. Too much fat leads to diarrhea! preesi

Preesi, CARBS are NOT good for doggies! Too much carb leads to diarrhea! Think about the exponential growth of diabetes in animals since they started eating dry dog food (AKA cereal) and remember that any dry dog food, no matter how much you pay for it, has to be at LEAST 40% grains in order for the extrusion process to work and to be shelf-stable without refrigeration. A LC dog is a happy dog:)Robyn Robyn Lori Rosenthal Sterling Cotons and Park Place Grooming Sterling, VA USA

Response:

I find I can reduce my bacon calories by sharing my bacon with my dog, Arthur.  It is a form of competitive eating.  Each time Arthur gets a hunk he needs about half a minute to devour it.  During this time I eat steadily, without being piggy.  Arthur returns several times until all of the bacon is gone.  I figure Arthur gets about 1/3 of the bacon and its calories. I hope this helps! Cubit 308/295.5/165

Response:

Question:

Unfortunately I have had several similar experiences.   I was losing the battle fast with the old recipe methods..  I am a bit over enthusiastic over these groups because the info I secured here was what I needed.  I have noted a large increase in the docs ability in the diabetes area.  A few do not want to look like a fool.   The pressure is on. Diabetes is one of thousands of disease the doc must treat so it is expected that they cannot be experts in every area.  The docs are still our mainstay but it is up to us to do our part.   Take control,, educate ourselves, and control out blood sugars. I do get irritated with those that want to show off on these groups.   Ego is much less of a issue compared with complications and even demise.    I was extremely impressed with Old  Al"s post this AM. excellent summary. If I have a broken arm I will depend on the doctor.  Over the years I have found out that with diabetes, I must do my part.  These groups have given me the opportunity to sort and pick data that applies to me.  To ignore other things. Still believe Test,Test, Test. Also learn,learn learn. You cannot even get in a pay restroom with the ego thing. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone noticed that many doctors are pampered babies.   When it is obvious incorrect observation is made by this type, they invoke "I am the doctor" I’ve noticed that as well, from another perspective. More than once I’ve been in meetings with MDs who, when someone won’t approve their view of how a thing should be done, shout "Unless you do it my way someone is going to die!" and storm or sulk out of the room. I’ve had that happen for years. When a few years ago I started working on lifestyle changes, look at the crazy answers I got back, now mostly disproved by the medical profession: 1. I was told by Dr Boyle in New Mexico, a principal investigator of the DCCT, that weightlifting would cause my kidneys to fail. He said the extra "pressure" on my body could cause my kidneys to fail. He also told me to go on a low protien diet, since protein was an indicator of kidney disaease, and hat since 13-15 years into diabets most Type 1 diabetics get kidney disease, I coudl avoid this. I pointed out to him that my kidneys didn’t have a clock, and my diabetes was in good shape, so how would an arbitrary time period mean I needed a low protien diet? I hav since been proven right, and that article was lsited a few years back o nabcnews.com. I had emailed a diabetic with kidney disease back in 1996, and she pointed out her kidney fxn, at 40%, stopped deteriorating after she started weightlifting. Her Dr told her it probably caused growth hormones to enter her body, which accelerated healing, and the lower blood ugars lessened and stopped the deterioration. So she already had kidney disease, and it stopped. Who was right? 2. Dr FRiedman, now editor of the Diabetes forecast, told me to get a btter meter rather than read it manually. He wouldn’t make a recommendation, said they were al lthe same, and even told me they coudl work with all of them. When I got an exactech pen and the credit card size meter, he got mad and told me I should have gotten a one touch, as they had cables and software for it to download to a computer. I told hi mthey had the same thing for the exactech, but he claimed they had an exclusive agreement to not use other meters o ntheir machines, so I couldn’t do that. This was the idiot who also doubled my insulin shot amouns to help me thru puberty, but despite having repeated insulin reactions refused to lower them. He kept tleling me it was normal and I should b more careful. When I got a disetronic insulin pump, they set my basal rates at half the amount I was taking, and my reactions stopped. The salesman even gave me a copy of the charts he’d made from a medical text showing MY INSULIN LEVELS WERE DOUBLE WHAT THEY SHOULD BE FOR MY WEIGHT AND HEIGHT!!! This was at the same hospital, so my nurse educator tried to et hi mto shut up, but his comment was "well no shit you’d been having reactions, it’s a wonder you aren’t dead". 3. Recently, I was told by a doctor at a free clinic that my lipid levels and cholesterol were too low for a type 1  diabetic. Despite being dx’d over 20 years ago, she told me to take Klonopin and increase my Ultralente dose by a third (which worked!), but neglected to mentio nside effects, such as loony drunken behavior or massive insuli nreactions. Her comment was that I ought to be put on glucophage, and that perhaps stress instead of affecting my diabetes, had caused me to have type 2. This despite about 21 years of insulin shots. I attributed this lower lipid level to weightlifiting and trying to take care of myself, a lack of alcoholism, and a lot of exercise and a decent diet. She told me I had stress, and needed glucophage. This despite my hospitalization in Dec 26 1982 from nearly dying due to a high BG, which resulted in my insulin Type 1 IDDM classification. Needless to say, my run ins with the medical professio nhave been pretty awful. I haven’t had medical insurance for several years, and unti lrecently I ahev been okay. I definitely think I could improve with some help now, but I mean,. damn, wil lit be thru an endo?

Response:

I have an Accusoft Advantage meter and I recently lost a lot of valuable data that I wanted to show my doctor because I had forgotten about the deletion factor once the meter stores 100 readings.  The manual says there is some kind of gadget that allows you to transfer the data from the meter to your computer and print it out from there if you want to.  Has anyone used this gadget by Accusoft and how does it work?  Is it very expensive, I am in Canada?  Is there any new meters available in Canada that store more than 100 readings in their memory or have any new state of the art features that people really like over the old models?  Thanks for your help. margo

Response:

I have an Accusoft Advantage meter and I recently lost a lot of valuable data that I wanted to show my doctor because I had forgotten about the deletion factor once the meter stores 100 readings.  The manual says there is some kind of gadget that allows you to transfer the data from the meter to your computer and print it out from there if you want to.  Has anyone used this gadget by Accusoft and how does it work?  Is it very expensive, I am in Canada?  Is there any new meters available in Canada that store more than 100 readings in their memory or have any new state of the art features that people really like over the old models?  Thanks for your help. margo

Pencil and Paper log book is cheaper… BJ

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have an Accusoft Advantage meter and I recently lost a lot of valuable data that I wanted to show my doctor because I had forgotten about the deletion factor once the meter stores 100 readings.  The manual says there is some kind of gadget that allows you to transfer the data from the meter to your computer and print it out from there if you want to.  Has anyone used this gadget by Accusoft and how does it work?  Is it very expensive, I am in Canada?  Is there any new meters available in Canada that store more than 100 readings in their memory or have any new state of the art features that people really like over the old models?  Thanks for your help. margo Pencil and Paper log book is cheaper… BJ

I agree,   After chasing all of the toys and software I printout a blank form and do an entry for each diabetic event.  Seems to best way for me.  I have a comment column                                             Guy

Response:

: Pencil and Paper log book is cheaper… BJ I don’t think doctors would trust the paper and pencil log book as much as the meter’s results.  Just my feeling about doctors though. margo

Response:

The UltraSmart has a built in Journal. I just purchased one and I am impressed by all of the journaling features. HOWEVER, I thought diabetes Mentor

Question:

can someone cut through the BS for me and help me find a list of Just what you can and can’t eat during induction?     thanks,

Response:

can someone cut through the BS for me and help me find a list of Just what you can and can’t eat during induction?     thanks,

Yes, its all in the book.

Response:

true, thanks Patricia. I just thought that I would try it out, but your way sounds better to me anyhow. thanks again

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why mess with it.  Exercise, eat plenty of fruit and veg, whole grains and legumes, limit fat, get enough animal products for protein, high-absorption iron, and B12. can someone cut through the BS for me and help me find a list of Just what you can and can’t eat during induction?     thanks,

Response:

Thanks for what is quite possibly the lamest reply, I have received all day.. you are one helpful bastard…NOT!!!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – can someone cut through the BS for me and help me find a list of Just what you can and can’t eat during induction?     thanks, Yes, its all in the book.

Response:

Why mess with it.  Exercise, eat plenty of fruit and veg, whole grains and legumes, limit fat, get enough animal products for protein, high-absorption iron, and B12. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – can someone cut through the BS for me and help me find a list of Just what you can and can’t eat during induction?     thanks,

Response:

Lol… They sell that at Walmart too…. pretty cheaply.  That is where I bought mine.  Our you can check out www.atkinscenter.com or www.atkinsdiet.com. — Email me at: perpleglow(AT)comcast.net

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Their a lame bastard because they don’t want to do your homework and type out the book for you?  Do you want us to come to your house and spoon feed you too??? Or roast a pig on a spit and hand feed it to you? It ain’t going to happen. if your curious byt stingy, "Get thee to a public library". Plenty of Atkins books on most library shelves.

Response:

Their a lame bastard because they don’t want to do your homework and type out the book for you?  Do you want us to come to your house and spoon feed you too???

Or roast a pig on a spit and hand feed it to you? It ain’t going to happen. if your curious byt stingy, "Get thee to a public library". Plenty of Atkins books on most library shelves.

Response:

Oops.. I meant They’re, not Their…. — Email me at: perpleglow(AT)comcast.net

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Their a lame bastard because they don’t want to do your homework and type out the book for you?  Do you want us to come to your house and spoon feed you too??? — Email me at: perpleglow(AT)comcast.net Thanks for what is quite possibly the lamest reply, I have received all day.. you are one helpful bastard…NOT!!! can someone cut through the BS for me and help me find a list of Just what you can and can’t eat during induction?     thanks, Yes, its all in the book.

Response:

Their a lame bastard because they don’t want to do your homework and type out the book for you?  Do you want us to come to your house and spoon feed you too??? — Email me at: perpleglow(AT)comcast.net

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for what is quite possibly the lamest reply, I have received all day.. you are one helpful bastard…NOT!!! can someone cut through the BS for me and help me find a list of Just what you can and can’t eat during induction?     thanks, Yes, its all in the book.

Response:

Thanks for what is quite possibly the lamest reply, I have received all day.. you are one helpful bastard…NOT!!!

The point being that induction isn’t the whole Atkins plan… and you really ought to read the book so you know exactly what the diet is about. And whether or not you should even try it. Induction is not for pregnant women for instance… and the diet may not be good for those with kidney disease. The book, which you can likely find at your local library if you don’t want to buy it, does indeed have the complete list of foods allowed on induction. Why make someone type it all out? Besides, chances are, you could find a list online if you searched. Also, how do you know, without reading the book, that the information someone might type here would be complete or even entirely accurate? You’d be taking your chances. If you are just dabbling with the diet as a means of quick weight loss… it may work for you, but if you can’t keep it up, chances are good you’d gain the weight back. Far better to read the book, find out if this is the kind of way of eating you can live with for life. Cynthia 262/238.5/200 first goal

Response:

Question:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -flyrcalot <bm…@scn.org> wrote: > I did a google search and did not come up with much.  So am posting > this question.  Sorry if it is so common it has been addressed a > thousand times. > My neighbor has been on dialysis now almost three years.  Every time > after dialysis he is in a lot of pain.  His back and legs hurt.  I sat > with him last nite.  He finished dialysis at 8PM.  He was thrashing > and turning and moaning until 3AM.  Then he finally went into sound > sleep.  He is on a whole handful of pills of course.  But none of them > seem aimed at controlling the bloody pain.  Because of the pain he is > living a horrid life.  And he is making the life of those around him > who are careing for him horrid. > His kidney doctor just last week finally suggested Ibuprofin.  We gave > him some today and he feels a lot better this evening.  I think he had > four of them.  What pain meds are ok for someone on dialysis.  I have > davoset and codiene cough syrup and sitting there listening to the > poor devil last nite I was bloody tempted to try one or the other.  I > did not know at that time that his doctor had blessed ibuprofin. > The pain after dialysis for several hours is bad enough I doubt if > Ibuprofin will be strong enough.  Anyone have any help out there?  Is > this normal?  I just want to be able to make suggestions to his family > so he and they can live as normal a life as possible.  I really like > these people.  They are wonderful neighbors.  No one should have to > suffer the way he is. > Thank you so much for any reponses you can make.

Sorry to hear about your neighbours conditions.. However I have a few Q’s I assume he’s on haemodialysis.  ??  (You didn’t specify??) What sort of pain is it?  Muscular..  Stabbing…  Is there any idea as to what it may be caused by? I used to get back & shoulder pain at first on haemodialysis, but this was mainly caused by being so tense from worry about my access (fistula)..  once I’d learnt to relax properly on dialysis this receded a great deal..  A decent chair also seems to help, I find.. Some dialysis chairs can be very uncomfortable, despite their intended design.. Has he tried any non drug pain control techiniques, such as meditiation, breathing exercises, or even massage post dialysis?   Pain is ususally worse if it is ‘eating you up’ and you are concentrating on it,.. if you can distract yourself or block it in some way this can sometimes offer relief.. I get the impression you’re in the US  but there is some general information on pain control on this renal site.. <http://www.kidney.org.uk/Medical-Info/kidney-disease/pain12steps.html>// Jim

Response:

This much pain IS NOT normal.  I don’t know if the pain is from cramping or from something else but he needs to address this with the doctor and the answer needs to be found.  Is he diabetic?  If so it could be diabetic nerve related.  If it’s something like drastically dropping sodium levels then it can be helped by them adjusting his prescription to drop the sodium gradually and slowly over the treatment time. Ibuprophen is not the answer there has to be something else going on here to cause this and there is no reason they can’t find what it is and treat him. The problem with pain meds is that in between dialysis sessions (especially if he’s on hemo) is that they can build up to toxic levels in the blood stream and can cause damage to other organs such as the liver. I used to get wound from just the mildest dose of pseudafed when I had a bad cold just because it builds up in your system. He needs to be assertive with the doctors.  If he can’t speak up for himself then someone in the family needs to speak up or even maybe you as a friend can do so.  It might be overstepping your bounds but sometimes the doctors just don’t understand how bad it is unless it’s coming from someone other than the patient. Celeste —     /_/   (>’o'<) _(,,)(,,)___)________SpotTheCat Celeste Come along a join our scrapbook group at – http://groups.yahoo.com/group/swappingwithoutflakers/ Check out my Ebay auctions for scrapbook supplies at http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/i_am_spot_the_cat/ For even better deals look at my Yahoo Auctions http://auctions.shopping.yahoo.com/booth/brionccc Kidney 96 *************************************************************************** * *********************** In the average time it takes an American to drive to work 45 minutes. At least 1 person dies! waiting for a life saving transplant. Get your organ donor card today! at the ~~~~  Transplant Resource Page ~~~~ http://www.TransplantResourcePage.com *************************************************************************** * *********************** 85 pages done in 2003 "flyrcalot" <bm…@scn.org> wrote in message

news:d47da581.0310041529.2419aa4c@posting.google.com… | I did a google search and did not come up with much.  So am posting | this question.  Sorry if it is so common it has been addressed a | thousand times. | | My neighbor has been on dialysis now almost three years.  Every time | after dialysis he is in a lot of pain.  His back and legs hurt.  I sat | with him last nite.  He finished dialysis at 8PM.  He was thrashing | and turning and moaning until 3AM.  Then he finally went into sound | sleep.  He is on a whole handful of pills of course.  But none of them | seem aimed at controlling the bloody pain.  Because of the pain he is | living a horrid life.  And he is making the life of those around him | who are careing for him horrid. | | His kidney doctor just last week finally suggested Ibuprofin.  We gave | him some today and he feels a lot better this evening.  I think he had | four of them.  What pain meds are ok for someone on dialysis.  I have | davoset and codiene cough syrup and sitting there listening to the | poor devil last nite I was bloody tempted to try one or the other.  I | did not know at that time that his doctor had blessed ibuprofin. | | The pain after dialysis for several hours is bad enough I doubt if | Ibuprofin will be strong enough.  Anyone have any help out there?  Is | this normal?  I just want to be able to make suggestions to his family | so he and they can live as normal a life as possible.  I really like | these people.  They are wonderful neighbors.  No one should have to | suffer the way he is. | | Thank you so much for any reponses you can make.

Response:

I did a google search and did not come up with much.  So am posting this question.  Sorry if it is so common it has been addressed a thousand times. My neighbor has been on dialysis now almost three years.  Every time after dialysis he is in a lot of pain.  His back and legs hurt.  I sat with him last nite.  He finished dialysis at 8PM.  He was thrashing and turning and moaning until 3AM.  Then he finally went into sound sleep.  He is on a whole handful of pills of course.  But none of them seem aimed at controlling the bloody pain.  Because of the pain he is living a horrid life.  And he is making the life of those around him who are careing for him horrid. His kidney doctor just last week finally suggested Ibuprofin.  We gave him some today and he feels a lot better this evening.  I think he had four of them.  What pain meds are ok for someone on dialysis.  I have davoset and codiene cough syrup and sitting there listening to the poor devil last nite I was bloody tempted to try one or the other.  I did not know at that time that his doctor had blessed ibuprofin. The pain after dialysis for several hours is bad enough I doubt if Ibuprofin will be strong enough.  Anyone have any help out there?  Is this normal?  I just want to be able to make suggestions to his family so he and they can live as normal a life as possible.  I really like these people.  They are wonderful neighbors.  No one should have to suffer the way he is. Thank you so much for any reponses you can make.

Response:

Some pain, I think occurs for the same reasons one gets cramps on dialysis – too much fluid being "pulled" out of the cell tissues and into the circulation. I think this happens particularly when there is too much sodium in the diet during the preceding days, with the result that more of the fluid weight gain is in the cells as opposed to the circulation (that is, in the blood). So, that might be one reason. I think some people may be susceptible to it, even though they may be following their diet. There might be other reasons I don’t know about also. I sometimes get painful muscles (or so it seems), in my abdomen, or in my legs, after dialysis and into the next say, even though I’m only 1 kg over my dry weight when I go in. Nobody knows why. Pierre "Jim W" <00senetnospamtoda…@macunlimited.net> wrote in message

news:1g2feeq.1vfx324egnls0N%00senetnospamtodayta@macunlimited.net… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> flyrcalot <bm…@scn.org> wrote: > > I did a google search and did not come up with much.  So am posting > > this question.  Sorry if it is so common it has been addressed a > > thousand times. > > My neighbor has been on dialysis now almost three years.  Every time > > after dialysis he is in a lot of pain.  His back and legs hurt.  I sat > > with him last nite.  He finished dialysis at 8PM.  He was thrashing > > and turning and moaning until 3AM.  Then he finally went into sound > > sleep.  He is on a whole handful of pills of course.  But none of them > > seem aimed at controlling the bloody pain.  Because of the pain he is > > living a horrid life.  And he is making the life of those around him > > who are careing for him horrid. > > His kidney doctor just last week finally suggested Ibuprofin.  We gave > > him some today and he feels a lot better this evening.  I think he had > > four of them.  What pain meds are ok for someone on dialysis.  I have > > davoset and codiene cough syrup and sitting there listening to the > > poor devil last nite I was bloody tempted to try one or the other.  I > > did not know at that time that his doctor had blessed ibuprofin. > > The pain after dialysis for several hours is bad enough I doubt if > > Ibuprofin will be strong enough.  Anyone have any help out there?  Is > > this normal?  I just want to be able to make suggestions to his family > > so he and they can live as normal a life as possible.  I really like > > these people.  They are wonderful neighbors.  No one should have to > > suffer the way he is. > > Thank you so much for any reponses you can make. > Sorry to hear about your neighbours conditions.. > However I have a few Q’s > I assume he’s on haemodialysis.  ??  (You didn’t specify??) > What sort of pain is it?  Muscular..  Stabbing…  Is there any idea as > to what it may be caused by? > I used to get back & shoulder pain at first on haemodialysis, but this > was mainly caused by being so tense from worry about my access > (fistula)..  once I’d learnt to relax properly on dialysis this receded > a great deal..  A decent chair also seems to help, I find.. Some > dialysis chairs can be very uncomfortable, despite their intended > design.. > Has he tried any non drug pain control techiniques, such as meditiation, > breathing exercises, or even massage post dialysis? > Pain is ususally worse if it is ‘eating you up’ and you are > concentrating on it,.. if you can distract yourself or block it in some > way this can sometimes offer relief.. > I get the impression you’re in the US  but there is some general > information on pain control on this renal site.. > <http://www.kidney.org.uk/Medical-Info/kidney-disease/pain12steps.html> > // > Jim

Response:

Question:

szozu <hoppbunny at hotmail dot com> wrote | | I don’t know if I mentioned recently, or if you’ve been reading this group | longer than posting on it, but I’m still waiting for the neuropathy to go | away, and now I’m waiting from a phone call from the dermatologist to find | out if I’ve got sarcoidosis as a result of treatment. The doctor who was | treating me had no clue and just shrugged his shoulders when I pointed out | the symptoms. The dermatologist took one look and told me he’d had another | IFN victim (oops–I mean patient!) who manifested with the same symptoms and | was diagnosed with sarcoidosis–not a very nice disease. Hi Lana, Seems to me you’ve been waiting for quite a while to get sarcoidosis (my fingers want to type scardiosis –dyslexic fingers) diagnosed/treated. Perhaps it wouldn’t hurt to get a second (or would this be a third?) opinion. All other threads aside, you have my greatest admiration for the way that you’re dealing with all this crap, and especially for your optimistic wit. Take care, and I sincerely hope you’re feeling better soon. Waterspider

Response:

szozu <hoppbunny at hotmail dot com> wrote in message news:3f5b3688$0$27578$626a54ce@news.free.fr… | Ahem! That should be B-R-A-I-N-F-O-G! I was going to post a reply about "Brainfor" but… I forgot, lol! Waterspider

Response:

Anonymous via the Cypherpunks Tonga Remailer <nob…@cypherpunks.to> wrote in message Excuse me Wagner, but I don’t have hepatitis. Glad to hear you don’t have hep, but I wonder why you spend so much time in hepatitis newsgroups. No criticism, just curious. Waterspider

Response:

"Waterspider" <noapam@all> wrote in message

news:vlmslmjn9cgna4@corp.supernews.com… > szozu <hoppbunny at hotmail dot com> wrote | > | was diagnosed with sarcoidosis–not a very nice disease. > Hi Lana, > Seems to me you’ve been waiting for quite a while to get sarcoidosis (my > fingers want to type scardiosis –dyslexic fingers) diagnosed/treated. > Perhaps it wouldn’t hurt to get a second (or would this be a third?) > opinion. > All other threads aside, you have my greatest admiration for the way that > you’re dealing with all this crap, and especially for your optimistic wit. > Take care, and I sincerely hope you’re feeling better soon. > Waterspider

Hey there! Well, I’m starting to feel slightly more energetic. Maybe the anaemia is resolving. And my hair is sticking straight up–must be those wee, little hairs holding up the slightly longer ones. I relentlessly chopped my hair off after tx to see what will come up! It’s only been one week since I saw the dermatologist, which is not that long, considering that the sample was sent to the hospital in Nice. The way I look at it, the first opinion is the doctor’s visual diagnosis (he’s also a pathologist, by the way) and the second opinion is the biopsy, the third opinion will be the blood tests that come after the biopsy and then the good news/bad news will come from the lung x-ray. Not everyone gets sarcoidosis in their lungs, but that’s the most common. :Your dyslexic fingers were partially correct. My disease is manifesting itself in what’s know as "sarcoid scars." What is a mystery to me is why only the venipuncture sites are reacting this way and not the real scars I’ve accumulated over my lifetime. I’ve been doing a lot of research on this malady and the only thing I’ve found that sounds similar to this is actually worse! What I need to see is if this will resolve on its own–many cases of sarcoidosis do. Obviously, this is one of those nasty auto-immune reactions that IFN is so famous for. Once you go down this road, often there’s no way back. This is much more serious than the neuropathy, though for the moment, it’s not painful. Ciao, bella! Lana

Response:

Bob <rtierney…@aol.com> wrote in message

news:ecd3ac92.0309070307.2d978f44@posting.google.com… | "Waterspider" <noapam@all> wrote in message

<news:vljvgll951rb03@corp.supernews.com>… | > Bob <rtierney…@aol.com> wrote … | >Waterspider, The last treatment gave me so many  major sides, that my | doc has declared that either the virus has mutated to reject/accept | the treatment, or that I have become allergic to Interferon. Within 2 | weeks of last treatment I could hardly walk, became borderline anemic | and dosages of thyroid medicine had to be tripled. By forth week I | became depressed/suicidal/homicidal/paranoid and generally antisocoil. | A long list of drugs, serazone,trazadone,zoloft,zyprexa, and finally | eskalith (lithium) were used to balance me out and keep me on | treatment. Projectile vommitting was the encore during the last month, | I could not walk any given distance, a football field maybe, without | rest, and then an immediate nap, I tried deliverying meals on wheels 4 | months after tx only to fear each day that I had either run too many | red lights, or forgotten someone and left them hungry. Memory was | tottally shot for almost a year. Physical rehab took me in a year and | a half after tx and I can now walk the mall or maybe 6 football | fields, with bench rest. Last nite I performed at a pig roast for an | hour and a half, doing 8 songs standing, 5 sitting…etc….Plus I | made 150 bucks (Don’t tell the good folks at ssdi) | If I use Interferon again, There is a 2 out of 3 chance my issues will | return and 1 in 20 chance that I will respond, last responce brought | pcr from 5 mil. to 27 mil!!! | My Liver and psycheee just can’t take it….But as Paul Simon | wrote.."Ah but I’m alright, I’m alright, just weary to my bones…. | My only hope is that they don’t mix interferon with protease | inhibitors…But thats two years down the the road and plenty of pig | roasts between now and then. | Thank you very much for asking though, also been thinking about | becoming a bus driver lol Hi Bobby, Okay, now I understand. From your first post I assumed that you hadn’t tried tx since 1990, and I was all set to tell you how much better it worked and how much less the sides were –but nevermind. The sides you experienced were like mine except for a few items: 1) I had no problem with my thyroid but became quite anemic; and 2) I couldn’t walk from one room to the next (never mind a football field, that would have killed me!) without a rest, but the nausea side only lasted a few weeks; 3) I didn’t drive for most of tx because I sort-of temporarily forgot how. I remember going along Garden Bay Rd. and downshifting for an approaching curve (I’d done this a thousand times at least). Clutch in, pull shifter knob… and forget where third gear went. Highly embarrassing and somewhat hazardous. Take care of yourself, and here’s hoping there’s a better tx not too far down the road. Waterspider

Response:

Ahem! That should be B-R-A-I-N-F-O-G! Lana "szozu" <hoppbunny at hotmail dot com> wrote in message news:3f5b21d2$0$10425$626a54ce@news.free.fr… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Bob" <rtierney…@aol.com> wrote in message > news:ecd3ac92.0309070327.12458300@posting.google.com… > > "szozu" <hoppbunny at hotmail dot com> wrote in message > <news:3f5a1199$0$20161$626a54ce@news.free.fr>… > > > "Bob" <rtierney…@aol.com> wrote in message > > > news:ecd3ac92.0309060359.6fe6bc58@posting.google.com… > > >  And when you fog out and walk in front of that > > > > bus, it was the hep, not the bus driver!!! > > > > Bobby > > > I’ve already done that! My brain was REALLY fogged after tx. Luckily the > bus > > > was going slow and the driver was paying attention. I looked up at him, > > > pointed to my brain with my index finger and did a little whirly motion > as I > > > shook my head. > > > Lana> > > > Lana, Just figured it all out, maybe the answer is driving busses! I > > was crossing the street one day, inter/riba/zoned to the max, looking > > like  aqualung, and suddenly the road felt all mushy and soft. I had > > walked into the middle of a section that just had concrete poured and > > the guys just completed smoothing it out. I just bent over and told em > > they could kick me as hard as they want. They were from another > > country and I couldn’t understand their words of encouragement, but at > > least I left my footprints somewheres on this earth > > Bobby > Oh my God! That’s funny! A friend of mind summed up brainfog quite well; she > said that when she needs to get something out of the refrigerator, her brain > says, "Open rectangular door." so she opens the door to the cupboard, > microwave, etc. Now that she’s started tx, she says that her brain is no > longer so precise and just says, "Open anything–a bottle, a window, > whatever!" > Lana

Response:

Bob <rtierney…@aol.com> wrote in message > > Lana, Just figured it all

out, maybe the answer is driving busses! I > was crossing the street one day, inter/riba/zoned to the max, looking > like  aqualung, and suddenly the road felt all mushy and soft. I had > walked into the middle of a section that just had concrete poured and > the guys just completed smoothing it out. I just bent over and told em > they could kick me as hard as they want. They were from another > country and I couldn’t understand their words of encouragement, but at > least I left my footprints somewheres on this earth

I drive the "Magic Bus" ;o) hc

Response:

"Deathray" <Deathra…@hotmail.com> wrote in message <news:vli73lnlhv8t76@corp.supernews.com>… > Has anyone had any luck with natural herbs and vitamins for hep-c. > vit-c and brewers yeast have been helpful, but i’m wondering if there’s > anything else that has helped. > Acidosis is also becoming a problem, is there something i can take for this, > or do i just have to develop the self control to watch my diet, which i will > probably never be able to do .      I read that kelp may help *shrug*. > Any suggestions????

Seems I may have had some luck. I took a protocol for quite a few years after I was diagnosed in 91. No doctor will recognize or even listen to the protocol and they call me a spontaneous responder and lucky. However, I can say, I got hep C in 86, (2 risk factors – 2 transfusions and a tattoo both all in the same year) absoulutely no question about it. In 96, I did have a viral load. Since then I have been undetectable. So who knows what happened???? Here is an interesting recent study that indicate how some supplimentation and herbals work. But there is no clear cut data on Herbs or suppliments on HCV clearance. I took _free form_ amino acids for 5 years 5x’s a week included with a bunch of other stuff. Free form was the most essential product listed in the guide I took my protocol from which was the "Prescription to Nutritional Healing" I seemed to have resolved pain from osteo arthritis (which is now deemed "severe degenerative disk disease" in the x-ray reports with glucosamine sulphate. But the doctors kinda make wierd comments about that. Once I had a psychatirist write a report to my physician, and included in his comments he said, patient suffers from A.B and C diseases, and also has osteo arthiritis. She claims she cured herself with glucosamine" Funny thing is, I walked to his office, walked, sat and moved about without any pain, and he had a copy of the x-ray and the report……. but ya know, I claim these things! Pasted below is the study. I can give you more if you like. Source: www.hepaticdiseases.com LIVER CIRRHOSIS- Nutritional Supplementation with Branched-Chain Amino Acids in Advanced Cirrhosis: A Double-Blind, Randomized Trial G. Marchesini (1), G. Bianchi (1), M. Merli (2) , P. Amodio (3), C.Panella (4), C. Lo guercio (5), F. Rossi Fanelli (2), R. Abbiati (6), Italian BCAA Study Group (1) Department of Internal Medicine, "Alma Mater Studiorum" University of Bologna, Bologna, Italy (2)Departments of Clinical Medicine and Gastroenterology, "La Sapienza" University, Rome, Italy (3)Department of Clinical and Experimental Medicine, University of Padua, Padua, Italy (4) Department of Medical Sciences, University of Foggia, Foggia, Italy (5)Department of Gastroenterology, II University of Naples, Naples, Italy (6) European Medical Affaires, BRACCO Imaging S.p.A., Milan, Italy Background & aims: The role of oral supplementation with branched- chain amino acids (BCAA) in advanced cirrhosis is far from settled. A nutritional approach might prevent progressive liver failure and improve nutritional parameters and quality of life. Methods: A multicenter, randomized study comparing 1-year nutritional supplementation with BCAA against lactoalbumin or maltodextrins was performed in 174 patients with advanced cirrhosis. Primary outcomes were the prevention of a combined end point (death and deterioration to exclusion criteria), the need for hospital admission, and the duration of hospital stay. Secondary outcomes were nutritional parameters, laboratory data and Child-Pugh score, anorexia, health- related quality of life, and need for therapy. Results: Treatment with BCAA significantly reduced the combined event rates compared with lactoalbumin (odds ratio, 0.43; 95% confidence interval, 0.19